God: The Failed Hypothesis

[paul]

Would you like to read this book "God: The Failed Hypothesis" by Victor J Stenger which eleborate how Science Shows That God Does Not Exist, Anyone read this book?

[kev woodman]

No, but this is similar to Richard Dawkin's stuff isn't it? The scientific equivalents of political shock-jocks.

The title is obviously intended to be controversial and sell as many books as possible. I read the blurb on Amazon and the ideas sound interesting though.

[Administrator]

Those who don't believe in God should believe in Newton's Third law

"To every action there is an equal and opposite reaction"

If you hit someone you will get a punch and if you help someone then he will help you. Dinosaurs got killed coz they got hit from Nature's reaction and same way humans will get killed one day if we don't stop destruction of forests and other Animals. Global warming is start of our end

[paul]

Good insight! btw you have also indirectly eleborated Newton's second law with the last two line, interesting.

"The acceleration of an object as produced by a net force is directly proportional to the magnitude of the net force, in the same direction as the net force, and inversely proportional to the mass of the object".

[Rodney]

Yes I will love to read that book, as reading gives me a lot of rest.Sometimes when I'm not able to sleep i like to read such books that help me to sleep.

[kev woodman]

Newton's laws apply only to physics - it is patently absurd to apply them to any other circumstance.

In the example Admin gives of someone getting punched if they punch someone this could only be a demonstration of the third law if the punch they got back was exactly equal and exactly opposite - something that clearly isn't going to happen in real life. And this would have to happen every single time given the same stimulus i.e. every time someone was punched they would have to receive a blow that was equal and opposite. In reality of course they may receive a punch but they are just as likely to receive some other sort of blow or receive no reaction at all.

What was nature reacting to in the case of the Dinosaurs? You seem to be suggesting that the 'dinosaurs' became extinct in one event which they caused in some way. Really?

And your first statement that 'Those who don't believe in God should believe in Newton's Third law' logically means that for every person who disbelieves in God should be aware that their will be someone else who believes in Him/Her. Again this really doesn't make any sense sorry.

This is what happens when people mix religion and physics.

[Administrator]

God is not covered under any religion but thats a power needed to run this word in right direction. Crime rate will rise in multiples if you convince every human to stop believing in God.

In my case I've always had something bad to see when I did something bad so I know that one of this works. If you say that you don't believe in Physics nor you believe in God then where do you get Categorized ?

I am not trying to act like a Monk but my concepts help me to become a better human being.

[kev woodman]

'God is not covered under any religion but thats a power needed to run this word in right direction.'

Not sure I understand what you mean by this.

Crime rate will rise in multiples if you convince every human to stop believing in God.

There's no evidence for this. I believe in God but I also believe that humans are able to make moral judgements without reference to religion. If you argue that people are only good because of a fear of/respect for God then that would logically suggest that atheists must be less trustworthy. I know many atheists who would point out that they live good, moral lives while some who believe in God commit acts of terrible evil.

In my case I've always had something bad to see when I did something bad so I know that one of this works.

But this karmic principle doesn't really hold true does it. There are plenty of people in the world who enjoy wealth, power and luxury but who maintain these through 'evil' actions. If anything those who live virtuous lives are less likely to be successful in any material sense.

If you say that you don't believe in Physics nor you believe in God then where do you get Categorized ?

By 'Physics' let's assume you mean the laws of physics. You don't have to believe in these - you can test them and see the results for yourself. If you're suggesting that you can have a belief in science or a belief in God but not both - that's a fallacy. Many scientists believe in God. It's not something you can categorise - you can be agnostic, atheist or theist when it comes to the existence of God but you can't be agnostic when it comes to physics.

[mark71]

yes and there is a new movie out....it is 5 minutes long...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QERyh9YYEis darwkins delusion

[mark71]

But what if all of Newton's laws arn't correct...they could be proved untrue at a later date...such as if things can go faster than the speed of light...which if theoratically if this could happen...which it can...time travel is also possible...

[jon123]

Don't know about religion or physics but i do know this:
Everything has a beginning a middle and an end, no exceptions, nothing lasts forever. This unfortunately includes this earth. you can come up with many reasons why global warming is taking place, me, I just accept that it is! I believe that co2 immissions are speeding up the process but in the end it is inevitable.

Co2 isn't the underlaying factor though, population growth is. Take the UK, vehicle congestion, electricity, gas, water and oil in short supply. Too many people, nothing to keep it in check.
Throughout history population growth has been 'surpressed' by war, no longer true

[Falesh]

But what if all of Newton's laws arn't correct

Then a lot of scientists would get very excited, there is nothing quite like a paradigm shift to get the blood going. :p

[kev woodman]

Actually Jon you could argue that the certain things can last, effectively, forever although their state may change e.g. although atomic elements can be created and changed left on their own they are capable of 'existence' for unimaginably vast periods of time.

Additionally the whole point of God is that it is beyond physical laws because it is responsible for the creation of those physical laws. You cannot apply your experience or knowledge of the physical world to God because God is not bound by the laws of that world.

[jon123]

Elements are being bombarded all the time and the change of state is the same as 'no longer existing in its natural form'. Using that thesis you could say when we die, we change state. Fact is we cease to exist. Ceasing to exist and changing state is just a play on words.
As far as I am aware, all elements decay......... they cease to exist.

The quantum theory that as long as there is no external force applied to an atom it can last forever, I would say, it's a theory and where do i find these dormant atoms?
Quantum physics is way over my head though, I once watched Quantum leap does that count?

[kev woodman]

I'd argue that ceasing to exist and changing state are more than just different ways of stating the same thing. Being a deist I obviously believe that death results in us changing state both in a physical and spiritual sense. Just as our earthly bodies are transformed into other substances our souls are also transformed. Although the process is significantly less squidgy.

I learned everything I know about Quantum Physics from Quantum Leap. Particularly the episode where Sam leaped into the body of Schrödinger's cat